Organisms

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You: How do you feel about abortion?

Stranger: pro

Stranger: abortion is made of win

Stranger: :D

You: Why?

Stranger: it is cheating life itself, in the words of Eric Cartman

Stranger: i feel no reason to be against it

You: So is murder.

Stranger: no

Stranger: that is ending life

You: So is abortion.

Stranger: cheating it is disallowing it in the first place

Stranger: abortion is not ending life

You: You're thinking of contraception.

You: Abortion ends a life.

Stranger: no

Stranger: it prevents life from beginning

You: abor·tion noun \ə-ˈbȯr-shən\
Definition of ABORTION

1
: the termination of a pregnancy after, accompanied by, resulting in, or closely followed by the death of the embryo or fetus: as

Stranger: and personally, i dont even care if it is murder

You: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/abortion

Stranger: it is not a self aware organism

You: Contraception prevents a life from beginning.

Stranger: it is a group of cells

You: So? It's still alive.

Stranger: so yes it is murder

You: Cells are units of life.

Stranger: but so is taking antibiotics

Stranger: so you go to hell for taking cough medicine?

Stranger: is that what youre saying?

You: So you have to be self-aware to have rights?

Stranger: so you disable your immune system?

Stranger: to save all those little single celled organisms who are living off of you?

Stranger: all the little bugs?

You: Are you saying only self-aware human beings have rights?

Stranger: no

Stranger: I am saying that people, self aware or not

Stranger: do not have rights

Stranger: you only have what you think you should have

Stranger: what you choose to have

Stranger: what you CAN and WILL take

Stranger: as a right

Stranger: the US army has spent years murdering people in afghanistan

Stranger: that is supported by christians

You: So is it okay to kill a newborn, who has no concept of "rights", and thus cannot claim any?

You: I don't give a crap what Christians support.

Stranger: yes

Stranger: yes

Stranger: and its not a newborn

Stranger: it is a foetus

You: I wasn't asking about a fetus.

You: I asked about a newborn.

You: Is it okay to kill a newborn?

Stranger: it is ok to kill anything that could do you harm

Stranger: I mean, shit, it happens in the animal kingdom all the time

Stranger: it is a natural process

Stranger: Lions will kill a lioness's cubs so she will be open to mating

Stranger: it is NATURAL

You: So there would be nothing wrong with just going around and shooting up a local preschool? Someone who did that should face no reprocussions?

Stranger: Depends entirely why they did it

Stranger: if it were a preschool in afghanistan

Stranger: where the taliban were hiring childrent

Stranger: who would be raised to fight

Stranger: and shoot

Stranger: and kill

Stranger: then yes

Stranger: it would be alright

Stranger: everything is subject to perspective

You: Why? What's wrong with what the Taliban are doing?

Stranger: what, raising children to fight?

You: According to you, it's totally natural to kill people.

Stranger: oh yes it is

You: How can you judge the Taliban as wrong?

Stranger: I never said it was wrong

Stranger: but it is in our nature to save ourselves at the cost of others

Stranger: to make it so that there is no competition

Stranger: hence, eliminate the opposition

You: Should a mother be allowed to kill her four-month-old child to make her life easier?

Stranger: well, it would be preferable to have an abortion before hand (WHICH IS WHY ABORTION IS THERE DUUUUUUUH), or to drop the kid off at an orphanage

Stranger: but, yes, if it were dependant on the survival of the mother, yes

Stranger: again, this is something natural

Stranger: i mean, if the mother died anyway, the child would die anyway

You: Why would it be preferable to have an abortion or drop the kid at an orphanage?

Stranger: because that would limit the suffering of the child with the same outcome for the mother

Stranger: I am not pro-suffering

Stranger: i am just anti-illogical

You: But suffering is natural.

Stranger: suffering is natural

Stranger: but so is the base instinct to avoid suffering at any cost

Stranger: that is why people feel pain

Stranger: and fear

Stranger: :/

You: And so is the base instinct not to kill your offspring.

Stranger: USE LOGIC PLEASE

Stranger: UNTIL IT PUTS YOUR LIFE IN DANGER

Stranger: as proven by the points above

You: The mother's life is not put at danger by the four-month-old, but you still said she can kill him.

Stranger: I said if it put the mothers life in danger

Stranger: IF YOU COULD PLEASE TRY READING

Stranger: :/

Stranger: durr

You: You said she could kill the child if it was dependent on her.

You: You said nothing about her life being in danger.

Stranger: on her survival

Stranger: dependant on her survival

Stranger: QUOTE

Stranger: :

Stranger: but, yes, if it were dependant on the survival of the mother, yes

Stranger: if the mother's survival depended on it

Stranger: DURR

You: "If it were dependent on the survival of the mother" and "if the mother's survival depended on it" are different things.

Stranger: no they arent

You: In fact, they're opposites.

Stranger: same thing phrased differently

You: There's a difference between "A depends on B" and "B is dependent on A"

Stranger: pah

Stranger: whatever

Stranger: my point still stands

You: If her life didn't depend on killing him, should she be allowed to?

Stranger: it doesnt mean I was wrong

Stranger: it depends on the situation

Stranger: if the child were to suffer needlessly before dying anyway, then yes

Stranger: it is RELATIVE TO PERSPECTIVE

You: The child is a healthy child; she just wants to kill him to make her life easier.

Stranger: in what way easier?

You: She doesn't have to take care of him anymore.

Stranger: what way would she kill him?

Stranger: would it suffer?

You: Not for long.

Stranger: then, well, if she has the stones to do it herself, then yes

Stranger: as you say

Stranger: there is a base instince

Stranger: instinct to preserve the life of the child

You: She tried to smother him.

Stranger: if she can do it yes

You: She should be allowed to?

Stranger: it takes a lot of willpower to overcome the mothering instinct

Stranger: yes

Stranger: why not?

You: Because she tried to murder her son!

Stranger: so?

You: So that's wrong!

Stranger: it makes it more of a crime than murdering a complete stranger in the name of your country?

Stranger: for reasons that someone else chooses?

You: I'm not for murdering foreigners either!

Stranger: it is not your place to tell people what to do or why

Stranger: you cannot force your opinions on other people

Stranger: just because you see it as right

Stranger: it doesnt make it right

Stranger: logic and reason should overcome the teachings of a society wrapped in bubbles and sunshine

Stranger: the world is a cruel harsh place

You: If someone decided to run into an elementary school, rape the kids, slowly torture the teachers, and set the place on fire, there would be nothing wrong with that?

Stranger: there would be a lot wrong with that

Stranger: that is a goal of hatred and rage

Stranger: of inflicting pain

Stranger: I said earlier that I do not support SUFFERING

You: Should they be allowed to do it?

Stranger: No

You: Why not?

Stranger: because that is an agenda of inflicting suffering and pain needlessly

Stranger: it is illogica

Stranger: illogical

Stranger: and stupid

You: According to you.

You: Why is it your place to tell people what to do or why?

Stranger: it isnt

You: You can't force your opinions on other people.

Stranger: it is my place to say what is logical or not

Stranger: because logic is basic

Stranger: like maths

Stranger: a universal absolute

You: You said he shouldn't be allowed to do that.

Stranger: Im not forcing it

Stranger: im not stopping anyone from doing

Stranger: it

Stranger: im not going out of my way to

Stranger: stop them

You: Oh, right, I misread.

Stranger: I just think that they shouldnt

Stranger: Im not saying that I wont allow them to

You: Wait, no I read it right.

You: You: Should they be allowed to do it?
Stranger: No

You: You said they shouldn't be allowed to do it.

Stranger: SHOULD THEY BE

Stranger: SHOULD

Stranger: HYPOTHETICAL

Stranger: it is a question of given that you could choose for it not to happen or for it to happen

Stranger: not ''would you force them not to''

You: If they did do it, should they face consequences?

Stranger: Yes

Stranger: because it is NOT NESSESSARY

Stranger: there is a law

Stranger: ''what is nessessary, is legal''

Stranger: nessessary

Stranger: that is not nessessary

You: Neither is abortion.

Stranger: it is not something in which your life would hang in the balance if it did or did not happen

Stranger: and abortion can be

You: I'm not saying I'm against life-saving emergency abortions.

Stranger: you said abortion in general

You: 99% of abortions aren't.

Stranger: is it now ok to decide WHEN abortion is ok?

Stranger: thats rather hypocritical dont you think?

You: You're the one who said murder is okay WHEN it's necessary.

Stranger: yes

Stranger: and I said that from the beginning

Stranger: at the beginning of this conversation

Stranger: you said abortion is murder

Stranger: and murder is wrong

You: So aren't you a hypocrite?

Stranger: ergo

Stranger: abortion is wrong

Stranger: but OH WAIT

Stranger: NOW

Stranger: its oh, abortion is wrong EXCEPT WHEN

Stranger: dot dot dot

Stranger: HYPOCRITE

You: When did I say abortion was murder?

Stranger: and no

Stranger: right about here

Stranger: So is murder.
You: no
You: that is ending life
Stranger: So is abortion.
You: cheating it is disallowing it in the first place
You: abortion is not ending life
Stranger: You're thinking of contraception.
Stranger: Abortion ends a life.
You: no
You: it prevents life from beginning
Stranger: abor·tion noun ə-ˈbȯr-shən\nDefinition of ABORTION

1
: the termination of a pregnancy after, accompanied by, resulting in, or closely followed by the death of the embryo or fetus: as

Stranger: there

You: I said it ended a life.

You: I didn't say it was murder.

Stranger: which you called murder

Stranger: ending a life is murder apparently

You: Squares, rectangles.

Stranger: ''so is murder'' ''so is abortion''

Stranger: you alikened them to the same thing

Stranger: gave them the same definition

Stranger: made them out to be equal

You: Abortion and murder are both ending life, but that doesn't mean abortion is murder.

You: Riddle me this, is an apple an orange?

Stranger: one, dont say riddle me this

Stranger: it is sad

Stranger: :/

Stranger: and two, likening two things to one another or equivilising two things to one another, especially in the manner you were, is IMPLYING that they were the same thing

Stranger: and you were implying for the sake of your argument

Stranger: and I know

You: I implied nothing. You inferred.

Stranger: IMPLYING is not the same as saying

Stranger: but hey

Stranger: dont be pedantic

You: Apples and oranges are both fruits. Does that mean that apples are oranges or that oranges are apples?

You: No.

Stranger: but they are both fruits

You: Abortion is homicide, and in some cases homicide is not wrong.

You: And abortion and murder are both taking life.

You: That doesn't mean abortion is murder.

Stranger: ha

Stranger: now youre arguing my side of the argument for me

Stranger: this is awesome

You: No, I'm not.

You: I'm just saying you're arguing against a strawman.

Stranger: no

Stranger: im arguing against an idiot

You: Abortion is an act of homicide. Like all homicide, it is sometimes wrong and sometimes not.

You: If it is to save your life, like homicide in general, it is sad but acceptable.

You: Otherwise, it's wrong.

Stranger: THAT WAS MY ARGUMENT JACKASS

You: Okay, it looks like we're misunderstanding each other. :/

Stranger: no

Stranger: looks like YOU misunderstood me

Stranger: and then tried to outwit me

Stranger: and make me look a tool

You: You misunderstood my point about murder.

Stranger: but poorly applying ethics

You: How do you feel about abortion that is not done to save the mother's life?

Stranger: if it is to end a child that will suffer

Stranger: pro

Stranger: frankly, im just generally pro abortion

Stranger: fuck it

Stranger: not my problem

Stranger: im not gunna stop people doing to their body what they want to do

You: The fetus isn't their body, though; the fetus is another organism.

Stranger: which is inside their bodyt

You: Yes.

Stranger: the fetus is

Stranger: AT THAT POINT

Stranger: a parasite

You: "Inside" and "part of" are not the same thing.

Stranger: and it is part of at that point too

Stranger: it shares the same circulatory system

You: That's not true.

Stranger: it is

Stranger: thats what the ambilical chord is for duh

You: Nutrient exchange occurs through the placenta.

Stranger: indeed it does

Stranger: but before a heart is formed

Stranger: the ovum depends entirely upon mother's nutrients

You: Nutrients, yes.

You: And the nutrients come from her circulatory system.

Stranger: so it is a part of her body

You: They do not, however, share a circulatory system.

Stranger: just like a cancerous tumor

Stranger: they do at that point

Stranger: until the foetus develops a circulatory system of its own

You: The mother's blood never enters the fetus, only the nutrients.

Stranger: the blood never enters muscle tissue either

Stranger: that process occours by diffusion too

Stranger: does that mean a muscle does not share the circulatory system with the organism?

You: Are you denying that the embryo is an organism?

Stranger: no

Stranger: all cells are organisms

You: No, they aren't.

Stranger: every cell is a seperate organism

Stranger: yes they are

Stranger: SINGLE CELLED ORGANISMS

You: Yes, but not all cells are organisms.

You: Some cells are part of organisms.

You: I am an organism. My thumb is not.

Stranger: how are you defining organsim right now?

Stranger: because the organelles in a cell are the cell's organs if you want to be pedantic

Stranger: which makes all cells organisms

You: No, they aren't.

You: They're cells, parts of a larger organism.

Stranger: so youre classing organism as a creature made up of lots of systems built up of seperate organs?

You: I'm not here to teach you 7th grade biology.

Stranger: im checking to what level youre classing organism

Stranger: I do A level biology

You: The fetus is not part of the mother.

Stranger: it is up to a certain stage of development

You: The fetus is dependent on her, yes.

You: But not a part of her.

Stranger: until it develops its own systems

Stranger: it is not an organism

Stranger: and until it becomes a seperate organism it is a part of the mother

Stranger: therefore it is the mother's right

Stranger: and even AFTER it becomes an organism

You: The fetus is a separate organism from conception. This is BASIC SCIENCE.

Stranger: by the points I have just made, no it is not

Stranger: Organism is a creature made up of lots of seperate systems

You: An organism that is dependent on another is still an organism

Stranger: if the creature does not have systems

Stranger: it is not an organism

Stranger: by your own BASIC SCIENCE DEFINITION

You: You're putting words in my mouth.

Stranger: a body made up of organs

Stranger: that is the definition of an organism

You: You said that, not me.

Stranger: that is THE DEFINITION

Stranger: THE ACTUAL DEFINITION

Stranger: without organs

Stranger: it is NOT an organism

Stranger: if it is not an organism

You: zygote
The single-celled organism that results from the joining of the egg and sperm.

http://www.plannedparenthood.org/health-topics/glossary-4338.htm#z

Stranger: it is a part of the mother

Stranger: that is the SINGLE CELLED ORGANISM definition

Stranger: made up of organelles

Stranger: which is what I asked you before you jackass

You: Not all cells are organisms.

Stranger: that also means that every cell in the body is an organism

You: A zygote is.

Stranger: form of life, such as a plant, animal, bacterium, protist, or fungus; a body made up of organs, organelles, or other parts that work together to carry on the various processes of life.

Stranger: all cells have organelles used to carry out the functions of life

Stranger: all cells are, therefore by that definition, organisms

Stranger: you have just been scienced

Stranger: now stfu

Stranger: :P

You: No.

Stranger: yes

You: A cell is PART of an organism.

Stranger: so is a zygote

Stranger: a zygote carries the INFORMATION for an organism

Stranger: but at the joining stage of sperm and egg

Stranger: it is still a cell

You: zygote One-celled organism resulting from fertilization. (40)

http://www.mhhe.com/socscience/devel/common/gloss/s-z.htm

Stranger: which is, TECHNICALLY an organism

Stranger: NO MORE SO THAN ANY OTHER CELL IN THE HUMAN BODY

You: The sperm and egg merge to form a little single-celled organism called a zygote

http://health.howstuffworks.com/pregnancy-and-parenting/pregnancy/issues/pregnancy1.htm

You: The human body is an organism.

Stranger: NO MORE SO THAN ANY OTHER CELL IN THE HUMAN BODY

You: No, individual cells in a human ARE NOT ORGANISMS.

Stranger: yes they are

You: No, they aren't. They're cells.

Stranger: The cell is the functional basic unit of life

You: Yes, they're what multicellular organisms are made of.

You: Cells are no more organisms than fingers are people.

Stranger: and, standalone, they are themselves single celled organisms

You: No, they're cells.

Stranger: a finger, along, if you left it with food would not survive

You: Not all cells are organisms.

Stranger: a cell in the human body, if left with food, would flourish, and grow, and divide

Stranger: it has organelles which carry out the basic functions of life

Stranger: which is the definition of organism

You: If you just plop a cell next to a hamburger, it would die.

Stranger: if you plop a zygote next to a hamburger it would die too

Stranger: JACKASS

Stranger: >:/

You: If you took a finger and pumped blood through it so all of its cells got nutrients, it wouldn't die.

Stranger: but then it would be attatched to a circulatory system

You: So?

Stranger: so it could not survive without the whole

Stranger: it could not survive on its own

Stranger: any cell in the human body could

You: It needs something to get the nutrients to its cells. An ad hoc "circulatory system" is the most efficient way to do that.

Stranger: yes

Stranger: so it cannot stand alone

Stranger: a cell can

Stranger: but look

Stranger: i need to go in a min

Stranger: ive loved this convo

Stranger: do you have an email address

You: Yeah.

Stranger: we could continue?

You:

Stranger: awesome

Stranger: Ill see you later bro

Stranger: :L

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